DaddyC Posted July 11, 2012 Report Share Posted July 11, 2012 Any further joys yet or whats the latest? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matt123roll Posted July 12, 2012 Author Report Share Posted July 12, 2012 (edited) Sorry for the lack of updates, been busy with work etcCopied this from my post on another forum with a similar thread:"Thought I would update. I spoke to the supplier of the plates who said he would send me some documents in the post. When they arrived one was a copy of the BSAU154d legislation, particularly the section relating to retroreflectivity. Another was a document (see attached - Excuse the wonky scan) which was apparently from the BNMA stating that there is/was/has never been a law to say pressed/metal/steel plates are illegal aslong as they conform to BSAU154D.I went to my local nick and asked the desk officer what I should do, I presented the plates, the FNP and the documents I had and she plainly said "take it to court" without me even really explaining. I ideally wanted a second opinion from another officer, hopefully a traffic one but didn't think this would happen as she was so abrupt with me, possibly because I'm young and fall under the stereotype of "a boy racer who probably deserves a fine" or something like that . Or possibly she deals with a lot of people who want to contest a FPN and so gives everyone the same answer.Anyway I digress. My only option is to take it to court but being 18 and a poor student I can't run the risk of court fees and legal advice etc leaving me pretty much no option but to pay the fine. Which I'm really gutted about as I truly do believe the plates are legal but the hassle of proving this is too much alongside working 8am-6pm 6 days a week so the plates will probably go in the bin (which is a shame as I really like them and after all they cost me money) and the fine will get paid and I'll become another member of the public who POSSIBLY paid a fine for an offence they didn't commit. But that's life and we live and learn. Thinking about getting a set of Dubmeister Pressed plates as people who have been stopped with them passed the company details on and dubmeister then phoned the police and the FPN was revoked.Thanks for all the help offered in this thread and it's unfortunate I couldn't resolve the matter another way. " Edited July 12, 2012 by matt123roll Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Silver! Posted July 12, 2012 Report Share Posted July 12, 2012 Thing is this is all "after the fact". Even if your plates do pass the test, what is to say they are the ones you had on when you were stopped. Your word against the constable I'm afraid.Really feel for you, but unless you are willing to risk the descision of a court, then you have no option really.Now you have all the documentation to support your legal plates, you could put them back on and if you get stopped again, show the documentation to prove their legality.However; I still cannot see how they are legal if you showed no documentation to get them made up as the law clearly states that documentation must be presented. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
treblet Posted July 12, 2012 Report Share Posted July 12, 2012 If you truly believe that the plates are legal then you should take it to court.The desk officer won't have given you any advice as that isn't their job. They are there to prevent crime (or complete paperwork in the case of a desk officer)It's the job of a solicitor to advise you in situations like this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deadmetal Posted July 12, 2012 Report Share Posted July 12, 2012 So you have proof that your plates are legal and the cop shop didn't want to know?Ask to speak to a traffic cop or some one higher up. don't say anything about the fine, plates or anything. Go straigh in and ask to see a traffic cop.Also, don't bin the plates, carry the BNMA paper work with you, so if you get pulled for the plates you can present them with proof that their legal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Defcon5 Posted July 12, 2012 Report Share Posted July 12, 2012 So you have proof that your plates are legal and the cop shop didn't want to know?No - he has a copy of the regulations and a generic letter.Why could the seller not send you a certificate of conformity to prove the plates he sells are legal? He must have some kind of accreditation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matt123roll Posted July 12, 2012 Author Report Share Posted July 12, 2012 Thing is this is all "after the fact". Even if your plates do pass the test, what is to say they are the ones you had on when you were stopped. Your word against the constable I'm afraid.They took photos as I've mentioned previously, to cover there own backs to ensure if it does go to court the plates used as evidence are the same as the photo they have.If you truly believe that the plates are legal then you should take it to court.The desk officer won't have given you any advice as that isn't their job. They are there to prevent crime (or complete paperwork in the case of a desk officer)It's the job of a solicitor to advise you in situations like this.While I'm aware of this solicitors cost money and with me working so much and trying to sort uni stuff out I just don't have the time to drag a court case out, I'm disappointed but only because I'm rolling over but I think this is how they get you with FPN. Your threatened with big fee's in excess of £500 if you take a FNP to court and loose so most people (including myself) will just pay the fine Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lupopo Posted July 12, 2012 Report Share Posted July 12, 2012 Did he take a photo? If not he has no evidence and the court will possibly find in your favor! Plus the cps may not even follow you up as £60 isn't worth the bother of summonsing you! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matt123roll Posted July 12, 2012 Author Report Share Posted July 12, 2012 No - he has a copy of the regulations and a generic letter.Why could the seller not send you a certificate of conformity to prove the plates he sells are legal? He must have some kind of accreditation.I quizzed him about why it wasn't a letter and he basically said BNMA were not willing to offer a written, adressed letter to any party and were only happy to send the regulations out in laimens terms, I've thought about contacting them directly but just have not found the time. I've pretty much give up with the seller, although helpful I didn't really get anywhere and he seemed to say a lot of things but there was no material proof as mentioned by other members. I believe him to be a genuine guy running a genuine business but I would warn others off the numberplate warehouse just to be safe. Not worth the hassle. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deadmetal Posted July 12, 2012 Report Share Posted July 12, 2012 No - he has a copy of the regulations and a generic letter.Which prooves the plates are legal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jamiea7x Posted July 12, 2012 Report Share Posted July 12, 2012 and so the moral of the story?shoulda not bothered with the hassle you went through and just paid the finealthough trivial its not worth taking on the law over the sake of 60 quid.the cops know this and why they seem to hand out all these nonsense fines Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matt123roll Posted July 12, 2012 Author Report Share Posted July 12, 2012 and so the moral of the story?shoulda not bothered with the hassle you went through and just paid the finealthough trivial its not worth taking on the law over the sake of 60 quid.the cops know this and why they seem to hand out all these nonsense finesTo be honest there was hassle but I was aware I had 28 days to pay the fine and didn't want to pay it in the first week and then get some profound evidence the plates were fully legal so I thought I'd asses my options. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lupopo Posted July 12, 2012 Report Share Posted July 12, 2012 Are the no plate reflective? Is the lettering the correct size? Is the lettering correctly spaced (10mm I beleive)? Have the plate got the British standard kite mark? And do the plates have the postcode of the supplier on them?? if so go to court and fight it!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Defcon5 Posted July 12, 2012 Report Share Posted July 12, 2012 Which prooves the plates are legal.No it doesnt.It states what standards must be met in order for the plate to be legal.It doesnt prove those particular plates meet the standards. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matt123roll Posted July 12, 2012 Author Report Share Posted July 12, 2012 Are the no plate reflective? Is the lettering the correct size? Is the lettering correctly spaced (10mm I beleive)? Have the plate got the British standard kite mark? And do the plates have the postcode of the supplier on them?? if so go to court and fight it!!Refer to the first couple of pages and see for yourself. They are correctly spaced, the font is charles wright 2001, the carry the postcode and name of the manufacturer as well as the BSAU154d and are the correct size. You going to pay for a solicitor? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scotty_82 Posted July 12, 2012 Report Share Posted July 12, 2012 Have you contacted the DVLA about the seller Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jamiea7x Posted July 12, 2012 Report Share Posted July 12, 2012 aye shop the seller in,its now his fault your out of pocket, Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Defcon5 Posted July 12, 2012 Report Share Posted July 12, 2012 The Vehicles Crime Act states that a number plate supplier MUST check documents before supplying a plate.They MUST keep a record of these documents and they MUST have this record available for inspection by the Police/TS. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matt123roll Posted July 12, 2012 Author Report Share Posted July 12, 2012 Would I also not be at fault for using plates on the road if they were obtained without showing documents etc Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scotty_82 Posted July 12, 2012 Report Share Posted July 12, 2012 Probably more so for him for advertising as fully road legal plates Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Defcon5 Posted July 12, 2012 Report Share Posted July 12, 2012 The seller is actually on the register of plate suppliers, albeit with a slightly different addressT N W Signs18 Hambledown RoadSidcupDA15 8DYTel: 0208 859 5840 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Defcon5 Posted July 12, 2012 Report Share Posted July 12, 2012 Would I also not be at fault for using plates on the road if they were obtained without showing documents etcNo, you have bought them in good faith. It is not your responsibility to show the docs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lupopo Posted July 12, 2012 Report Share Posted July 12, 2012 Trust defcon 5 and me, we should know! Plus your get legal aid as your entitled to free independent legal advice as part of your right to a fair trial :0D Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skezza Posted July 13, 2012 Report Share Posted July 13, 2012 (edited) Regardless of the ins and outs and what not of whether these plates were manufactured legally, it's a bit tight of the coppers. Those plates are very easy to read for other drivers although I don't know what the rule with reflection for cameras etc.I see a guy driving his Audi TT to work everyday and his plates have been botched so they read his name however I'm still unsure as to what the letters/numbers are. It's totally unreadable, in a formal sense. Yet, I see him drive past coppers quite happily without being stopped. Obviously driving an Audi makes you better than everyone else. No doubt if I drove past the same copper in my Lupo with plates like that, they'd be stopping me in no time. Edited July 13, 2012 by Skezza Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scotty_82 Posted July 13, 2012 Report Share Posted July 13, 2012 Moaning about other peoples plates doesn't make this case any less or more wrong Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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