Shantybeater Posted November 11, 2015 Report Share Posted November 11, 2015 (edited) Hi all,I just drove a 22 hour round trip to pickup a 1.8T converted Lupo GTI in the pouring wind/rain. The car is well known to the forum so i'm a little disappointed to find the underside in a right state (serves me right for not checking ) but from what I understand it has been left sat for sometime (years). The jacking points have been flattened with several dents to the sill itself. As a result rust has set in badly and the passenger side sill is showing bubbling under the paint in several places further up on the panel (from the exterior). As I understand it this panel cannot be replaced and is in fact part of the shell? is that correct? I have very little experience with rust especially to this level, i'll post up some pics shortly for comments, but i'd appreciate some advice on what to do.The car is awaiting a downpipe to get it moving so I can't get it to a bodyshop yet..but i'm expecting a hefty bill to resurrect. Edited November 11, 2015 by Shantybeater Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sausage Posted November 12, 2015 Report Share Posted November 12, 2015 (edited) if thats the 1.8t i think it is then i'd be bloody annoyed too if that wasnt disclosed.I'd just clean it all up with wire brush / flap wheel in an angle grinder, cut out the crap back to good metal, bend reshape the flattened seam and see what you've got.it probably just needs a small patch welded in, no point replacing the whole sill if that is all the rust there, but if the sills are badly mangled and dented then it might be worth doing. Are sills even available?Dents can be pulled with slide hammer, either welded or glued on. Edited November 12, 2015 by Sausage Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skezza Posted November 12, 2015 Report Share Posted November 12, 2015 Hi shanty,Like Sausage, I think I know which 1.8T it is, although I was slightly concerned at how it looked in the ad myself, hence me not contacting the seller (been looking for a 1.8T for a while). Not going to turn this into a witch hunt though because I've not seen the car and photos don't usually tell the whole story, there may be nothing wrong with it (other than the rust you've highlighted).Still, as per above, I think you'll be able to lift most of that rust using a wire brush and some elbow grease. I'd refrain from using a flap wheel for the moment, only because they're a bit harder to control and most of that rust doesn't look too deep, although it's starting to get a little bit rough in patches. Once you've lifted the rust, you can easily patch weld that little crack no problem.The jacking points get damaged on these cars quite a lot unfortunately. It might not be the previous sellers fault though. I can't remember the last time I went to a tyre place and they didn't use the marked 'jacking points'. Those jacking points are for the scissor jack only really. You want to be jacking either on the front wishbone or perhaps using a wooden chock under the black rubber mark (as i've heard recommended by a few).If it was me, I would bend the original sill back using some pliers and flatten it using a hammer. I would hazard a guess that it would still be suitable for the scissor jack (despite sustaining what may seem like significant damage). I had to bend mine back and it still works with the **** scissor jack. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sausage Posted November 12, 2015 Report Share Posted November 12, 2015 (edited) This is what i had in mind on a 5 inch grinder, (a handraulic wire brush wont hardly touch it): Edited November 12, 2015 by Sausage Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skezza Posted November 12, 2015 Report Share Posted November 12, 2015 This is what i had in mind on a 5 inch grinder, (a handraulic wire brush wont hardly touch it): That looks crazy for rust removal, fair do though Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sausage Posted November 12, 2015 Report Share Posted November 12, 2015 Very controllable and straight to bare metal in seconds 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shantybeater Posted November 12, 2015 Author Report Share Posted November 12, 2015 (edited) Thanks guys, to be honest this is way beyond anything I have taken on before but on a positive note I may learn a thing or two along the way. Yes I'm peeved as it wasn't exactly cheap, and I struggle to see how anyone could miss this whether they were using the car or not (just a clean would highlight this!) but I blame myself for being a bit too trusting & not doing the usual checks. I suppose that's what 8 hours driving does to your judgement in the rain/cold!Buying from well known forum members has worked out well in the past and I knew it was a bit of a gamble (as in theory a non-runner). If I were to break it down I may be able to recoup the majority of my costs (I think) so its not the end of the world and I refuse to get too angry about it, life's too short.Sausage - if you know anymore about said car please PM me, as I said its a non-runner and if you suspect other problems i'd rather know about them sooner rather than spend good money after bad!I contacted a bodyshop today, but I'm fortunate enough to have a garage to work on the car out of the weather, I will follow your advice, so thanks for chipping in, wish me luck!!. I'll be getting some wire brushes and seeing how bad this really is!! Question - If I were to angle grind the jacking beam/seam would it risk the two panels separating? they look to meet at the jacking point and the last thing I want to do is remove any last support holding the panels together!!! Edited November 12, 2015 by Shantybeater 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sausage Posted November 12, 2015 Report Share Posted November 12, 2015 I dont have any knowledge of the car sorry, it probably isnt the one i was thinking of anyway...Question - If I were to angle grind the jacking beam/seam would it risk the two panels separating? they look to meet at the jacking point and the last thing I want to do is remove any last support holding the panels together!!!The flattened seam i would not be cutting at all unless absolutely needed, just gradually bend / lever it back down into position and then wack it with a lump hammer and a flat chunk of wood to get it reasonably straight. hopefully it wont crack on you and it will just be cosmetic. if it cracks that will need welding as well. Any levering against the sill put some long wood there to spread the load otherwise you just dent the sill more. If it is beyond you then you could still do most of clean up / prep and get someone else to make and weld the patch in. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skezza Posted November 12, 2015 Report Share Posted November 12, 2015 It's a GTI, which does change the rules a bit. I'm sure we were talking about this a few weeks back. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shantybeater Posted November 12, 2015 Author Report Share Posted November 12, 2015 (edited) I dont have any knowledge of the car sorry, it probably isnt the one i was thinking of anyway...The flattened seam i would not be cutting at all unless absolutely needed, just gradually bend / lever it back down into position and then wack it with a lump hammer and a flat chunk of wood to get it reasonably straight. hopefully it wont crack on you and it will just be cosmetic. if it cracks that will need welding as well. Any levering against the sill put some long wood there to spread the load otherwise you just dent the sill more. If it is beyond you then you could still do most of clean up / prep and get someone else to make and weld the patch in.Well the problem is the jacking seam itself is rusty and I suspect this where the rust has started? surely I need to remove what rust I can of it to stop any further spreading? I'll take some more photos tonight as I just took one of the worst of it (being the sill) Edited November 12, 2015 by Shantybeater Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shantybeater Posted November 12, 2015 Author Report Share Posted November 12, 2015 Ok so i've had a little go with a wire brush, the worst part is actually the dip behind the sill before it meets the jack beam/seam which isn't visible unless underneath the car. I have taken the arch liner out and see no obvious signs elsewhere of bubbling or rustPeeking through the hole it doesn't look like any of the inner panels have sign of rust either. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shantybeater Posted November 12, 2015 Author Report Share Posted November 12, 2015 If you are scream-ish look away!!Wheel arch to the right, remainder of jacking beam at the bottom:Looking down the sill, jacking beam on the rightI think its going to need a fair bit of metal welded in to cover this gap! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skezza Posted November 12, 2015 Report Share Posted November 12, 2015 Ok that's more than I thought. I reckon you can still buy new sills for the gti. Rich or Pete probably know whether they're still available. It's still fixable but I'm wondering whether cost wise it'd be better get new sills. You could get a quote from a garage? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shantybeater Posted November 12, 2015 Author Report Share Posted November 12, 2015 (edited) I thought the sills were part of the entire quarter panel so you can't buy them separately? If its possible i'd much rather go that way as it would seem like a more complete jobThanks for the help btw Edited November 12, 2015 by Shantybeater Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sausage Posted November 12, 2015 Report Share Posted November 12, 2015 (edited) Yes rustier than it looked in 1st pic. It's usually 10x what you see on the surface.There is no seam worth saving there is there , that can still be patch repaired though, but it will always look like it's been patched unless you have awesome skills.You need to have a real good look around the car and work out if it worth repairing or not. before getting bogged down fixing this corner. Edited November 13, 2015 by Sausage Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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