Jump to content

engine/road speed


Recommended Posts

I need some help with getting some facts about the 5 speed gearbox on the GTi....

I have a 2001 (y reg) Gti and i'm getting mixed opinions on which box should be in the car, the dealer seems to think its an FHE ( i think) whereas the gearbox centre that repaired my selector fork seems to think its an 02T?

anyway to cut a long story short the box was sent off to have the 3rd gear selector fork repaired (jumping out of gear) but now that the box is back in the car, its very stiff to change into reverse, 1st, 3rd and 5th gears (push selection?) and the ratios seem taller as it doesnt accelerate very well and is now doing 400-500rpm less than it did before at motorway speeds.

Can Anyone confirm what speeds the car should be doing at say 4000rpm in fifth gear (mine used to be between80- 85mph) its now over 90!

Finally since the box was changed it also seems to be drinking more fuel?

Edited by Toi gulp
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Isnt the gearbox code printed in the front of the manual?

nope.........i may be wrong but i doubt looking on the casing will help either as i need to know whether the ratio's are actually correct. its like they put a box in from a bigger engined car or a deisel or something

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Have you changed a selector cable? Sounds like its miss rigged.

Sounds like all of your gears are out, your probably engaging a higher gear than your selecting.

How did you rig the gearbox?

FHE is the gearbox code, 02TC is the gearbox number. They are two different things.

According to etka from your year of car, you can only have an FHE or an FCG gearbox. Both of these have the 02TC gearbox number. I think the FHE is for the UK spec gti models.

What did they change inside the gearbox?

Edited by CasperGTI
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Have you changed a selector cable? Sounds like its miss rigged.

Sounds like all of your gears are out, your probably engaging a higher gear than your selecting.

How did you rig the gearbox?

FHE is the gearbox code, 02TC is the gearbox number. They are two different things.

According to etka from your year of car, you can only have an FHE or an FCG gearbox. Both of these have the 02TC gearbox number. I think the FHE is for the UK spec gti models.

What did they change inside the gearbox?

O.k. so there should only be one type of 5 speed box fitted to my car then....

Awesome gti actually got the box out an a gearbox place in manchester did the work and as far as i know they said they were going to put a repaired selector fork in it as the box was delivered to them allready disasembled. now i suspect that they have provided me with a different gearbox altogether with slightly different ratios.

Awesome then re-fitted the box and discovered they could change gear on the box itself with relative ease its only when the cable was re-fitted that the difficult selection appeared, so they think the cable has frayed in its sheath.

I dont fully understand what you mean about rigging the box?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

YES!

The reason your selecting is poor is becasue the cable is knackered, id fix it before you ruin the gearbox again!

Rigging of the gearbox can be found in the how to section

http://forums.clublupo.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=56533

Now, for the other issue 02T Is the start of the gearbox number, Your FHE gearbox has an 02TC gearbox number.

Mabe the wrong final drive has been put in.

Edited by CasperGTI
Link to comment
Share on other sites

yeah i allready understand the cable being the likely cause of the stiff changes. i was just curious as to whether it could indicate a discrepancy with the box

What about the different ratio's? hows best to find out if its rite or not....is there a final drive ratio listed?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Manual gearbox

5 speed: 02T

Code: FHE

Lupo GTI

Engine: 1.6 ltr. - 92 kW

Ratio: Z2 : Z1

Final drive

65 : 18 = 3.611

1st gear

38 : 11 = 3.455

2nd gear

44 : 21 = 2.095

3rd gear

43 : 30 = 1.433

4th gear

41 : 38 = 1.079

5th gear

41 : 46 = 0.891

Reverse gear

35 : 24 x 24 : 11 = 3.182

Edited by CasperGTI
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I have now done the calcs, and if my figures are correct for tyre diamter (which i suspect they wont as i cant find true laden radius for my tyres) the engine should be doing in the region of 4197rpm at 85mph in fifth gear which about figures out with how the box was origionally.

with the engine currently turning over approximately 500rpm slower theres a ratio difference of about 10%

lest see what the gearbox place sais to that.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Using the below calculation i am able to establish that the gearbox is too tall geared:

Final Drive 3.611

5th 0.891

Tyre 195/45 r15

Tyre diameter = 556mm

Tyre Circumference = 556x pie = 1746.72mm = 0.001746km

Convert to miles x 0.62137119207 = 0.00108536 miles

1 miles = 921 revolutions

Wheel rpm at 85mph =85 x 921 = 78315rph / 60 = 1035.3 rpm

Engine rpm = 1035.3 x 3.611 x 0.891 = 4197rpm

Therefore:

  • in 1st gear @ 20mph the engine should be doing 3830rpm (actual: 3450 approx)
  • in 2nd gear @ 40mph the engine should be doing 4644rpm (actual: 4100 approx)
  • in 3rd gear @ 60mph the engine should be doing 4765rpm (actual: 4050 approx)
  • in 4th gear @ 70mph the engine should be doing 4186rpm (actual: 3700 approx)
  • in 5th gear @ 85mph the engine should be doing 4197rpm (actual: 3800 approx)

And with this calculation i have been able to establish that in each gear the engine is spinning too slow and i've just been out and road tested and confirmed this. I will give the garage in question a chance to sort it otherwise if its allowed on the forum they will be named and shamed

Edited by Toi gulp
Link to comment
Share on other sites

You dont have much luck with garages mate ill give you that, was it the same peoples as last time.

no i dont......mind you with the exception of Awesome and a garage ive been to in chester and howard basford theyve all cocked something up

i'm not stupid enough to take my car back to someone who ****ed up last time

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Well ive spoken to the gearbox specialist and after forcing them to look at the job card (very rude staff) they said they had changed 5th gear ratio from .89 to .85 but even so that still doesnt balance out with the maths

Ive also spoken to VW and they said that 5th gear is the easiest ratio to change and so its more than likely that they had.......What pisses me off though is they didnt even bother to tell me!

I'm still not convinced that theyve just changed both shafts as i cant explain why the car seems slower through all gears?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

It sounds to me like you just wanted to get the box refurbed, not changed in anyway, if they are to do anything that you have not asked them to, they have to tell you, thats the law (i am lead to believe anyway).

If i was you i would give them the chance to put it right, or go to trading standards or CAB.

Good luck with it pall.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 2 weeks later...

A little update, on the gearbox, it turned out they actually put a .81 ratio in for 5th which equates to a little over 9% difference if i remember rightly.

And now theyve decided to get a new 3rd gear for my origional shaft (3rd was knackered) and they'll fit that along with my origional shaft back into the box so they know then the ratios will be correct....Why they didnt do this in the first place is stupid!

So a word of warning allways check your cogs when a gearbox 'specialist' goes near your gearbox.............they may try and bull**** you as these guys repeatedly have!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Loading...
 Share

×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

By using this site, you agree to our Terms of Use.