Toi gulp Posted January 3, 2010 Report Share Posted January 3, 2010 (edited) I need some help with getting some facts about the 5 speed gearbox on the GTi....I have a 2001 (y reg) Gti and i'm getting mixed opinions on which box should be in the car, the dealer seems to think its an FHE ( i think) whereas the gearbox centre that repaired my selector fork seems to think its an 02T?anyway to cut a long story short the box was sent off to have the 3rd gear selector fork repaired (jumping out of gear) but now that the box is back in the car, its very stiff to change into reverse, 1st, 3rd and 5th gears (push selection?) and the ratios seem taller as it doesnt accelerate very well and is now doing 400-500rpm less than it did before at motorway speeds.Can Anyone confirm what speeds the car should be doing at say 4000rpm in fifth gear (mine used to be between80- 85mph) its now over 90!Finally since the box was changed it also seems to be drinking more fuel? Edited January 3, 2010 by Toi gulp Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Defcon5 Posted January 3, 2010 Report Share Posted January 3, 2010 Isnt the gearbox code printed in the front of the manual? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toi gulp Posted January 3, 2010 Author Report Share Posted January 3, 2010 Isnt the gearbox code printed in the front of the manual?nope.........i may be wrong but i doubt looking on the casing will help either as i need to know whether the ratio's are actually correct. its like they put a box in from a bigger engined car or a deisel or something Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CasperGTI Posted January 3, 2010 Report Share Posted January 3, 2010 (edited) Have you changed a selector cable? Sounds like its miss rigged.Sounds like all of your gears are out, your probably engaging a higher gear than your selecting.How did you rig the gearbox?FHE is the gearbox code, 02TC is the gearbox number. They are two different things.According to etka from your year of car, you can only have an FHE or an FCG gearbox. Both of these have the 02TC gearbox number. I think the FHE is for the UK spec gti models.What did they change inside the gearbox? Edited January 3, 2010 by CasperGTI Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toi gulp Posted January 3, 2010 Author Report Share Posted January 3, 2010 Have you changed a selector cable? Sounds like its miss rigged.Sounds like all of your gears are out, your probably engaging a higher gear than your selecting.How did you rig the gearbox?FHE is the gearbox code, 02TC is the gearbox number. They are two different things.According to etka from your year of car, you can only have an FHE or an FCG gearbox. Both of these have the 02TC gearbox number. I think the FHE is for the UK spec gti models.What did they change inside the gearbox?O.k. so there should only be one type of 5 speed box fitted to my car then....Awesome gti actually got the box out an a gearbox place in manchester did the work and as far as i know they said they were going to put a repaired selector fork in it as the box was delivered to them allready disasembled. now i suspect that they have provided me with a different gearbox altogether with slightly different ratios.Awesome then re-fitted the box and discovered they could change gear on the box itself with relative ease its only when the cable was re-fitted that the difficult selection appeared, so they think the cable has frayed in its sheath.I dont fully understand what you mean about rigging the box? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CasperGTI Posted January 3, 2010 Report Share Posted January 3, 2010 Have you changed that cable yet? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toi gulp Posted January 3, 2010 Author Report Share Posted January 3, 2010 No, you suspect that's the problem? thats what awesome reckoned caused the selector fork to wear out... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CasperGTI Posted January 3, 2010 Report Share Posted January 3, 2010 (edited) YES!The reason your selecting is poor is becasue the cable is knackered, id fix it before you ruin the gearbox again!Rigging of the gearbox can be found in the how to sectionhttp://forums.clublupo.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=56533Now, for the other issue 02T Is the start of the gearbox number, Your FHE gearbox has an 02TC gearbox number.Mabe the wrong final drive has been put in. Edited January 3, 2010 by CasperGTI Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toi gulp Posted January 3, 2010 Author Report Share Posted January 3, 2010 yeah i allready understand the cable being the likely cause of the stiff changes. i was just curious as to whether it could indicate a discrepancy with the boxWhat about the different ratio's? hows best to find out if its rite or not....is there a final drive ratio listed? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CasperGTI Posted January 3, 2010 Report Share Posted January 3, 2010 (edited) Manual gearbox 5 speed: 02T Code: FHE Lupo GTI Engine: 1.6 ltr. - 92 kW Ratio: Z2 : Z1 Final drive 65 : 18 = 3.611 1st gear 38 : 11 = 3.455 2nd gear 44 : 21 = 2.095 3rd gear 43 : 30 = 1.433 4th gear 41 : 38 = 1.079 5th gear 41 : 46 = 0.891 Reverse gear 35 : 24 x 24 : 11 = 3.182 Edited January 3, 2010 by CasperGTI Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toi gulp Posted January 3, 2010 Author Report Share Posted January 3, 2010 cheers casper,lets see if i can work it all out now then Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toi gulp Posted January 3, 2010 Author Report Share Posted January 3, 2010 I have now done the calcs, and if my figures are correct for tyre diamter (which i suspect they wont as i cant find true laden radius for my tyres) the engine should be doing in the region of 4197rpm at 85mph in fifth gear which about figures out with how the box was origionally.with the engine currently turning over approximately 500rpm slower theres a ratio difference of about 10%lest see what the gearbox place sais to that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toi gulp Posted January 4, 2010 Author Report Share Posted January 4, 2010 (edited) Using the below calculation i am able to establish that the gearbox is too tall geared:Final Drive 3.6115th 0.891Tyre 195/45 r15Tyre diameter = 556mmTyre Circumference = 556x pie = 1746.72mm = 0.001746kmConvert to miles x 0.62137119207 = 0.00108536 miles1 miles = 921 revolutionsWheel rpm at 85mph =85 x 921 = 78315rph / 60 = 1035.3 rpmEngine rpm = 1035.3 x 3.611 x 0.891 = 4197rpmTherefore:in 1st gear @ 20mph the engine should be doing 3830rpm (actual: 3450 approx)in 2nd gear @ 40mph the engine should be doing 4644rpm (actual: 4100 approx)in 3rd gear @ 60mph the engine should be doing 4765rpm (actual: 4050 approx)in 4th gear @ 70mph the engine should be doing 4186rpm (actual: 3700 approx)in 5th gear @ 85mph the engine should be doing 4197rpm (actual: 3800 approx)And with this calculation i have been able to establish that in each gear the engine is spinning too slow and i've just been out and road tested and confirmed this. I will give the garage in question a chance to sort it otherwise if its allowed on the forum they will be named and shamed Edited January 4, 2010 by Toi gulp Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lupoluke Posted January 4, 2010 Report Share Posted January 4, 2010 You dont have much luck with garages mate ill give you that, was it the same peoples as last time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toi gulp Posted January 4, 2010 Author Report Share Posted January 4, 2010 You dont have much luck with garages mate ill give you that, was it the same peoples as last time.no i dont......mind you with the exception of Awesome and a garage ive been to in chester and howard basford theyve all cocked something upi'm not stupid enough to take my car back to someone who ****ed up last time Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lupoluke Posted January 4, 2010 Report Share Posted January 4, 2010 Fare doo`s pall, i need to get my head reconditioned but at this rate with the garages round here id rather have ago at doin it my self, and i havent seen you about in a while. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toi gulp Posted January 6, 2010 Author Report Share Posted January 6, 2010 Well ive spoken to the gearbox specialist and after forcing them to look at the job card (very rude staff) they said they had changed 5th gear ratio from .89 to .85 but even so that still doesnt balance out with the mathsIve also spoken to VW and they said that 5th gear is the easiest ratio to change and so its more than likely that they had.......What pisses me off though is they didnt even bother to tell me!I'm still not convinced that theyve just changed both shafts as i cant explain why the car seems slower through all gears? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lupoluke Posted January 6, 2010 Report Share Posted January 6, 2010 It sounds to me like you just wanted to get the box refurbed, not changed in anyway, if they are to do anything that you have not asked them to, they have to tell you, thats the law (i am lead to believe anyway). If i was you i would give them the chance to put it right, or go to trading standards or CAB. Good luck with it pall. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toi gulp Posted January 15, 2010 Author Report Share Posted January 15, 2010 A little update, on the gearbox, it turned out they actually put a .81 ratio in for 5th which equates to a little over 9% difference if i remember rightly.And now theyve decided to get a new 3rd gear for my origional shaft (3rd was knackered) and they'll fit that along with my origional shaft back into the box so they know then the ratios will be correct....Why they didnt do this in the first place is stupid!So a word of warning allways check your cogs when a gearbox 'specialist' goes near your gearbox.............they may try and bull**** you as these guys repeatedly have! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lupoluke Posted January 15, 2010 Report Share Posted January 15, 2010 I was thinking of this today, we was doin a gear box on a bolf, glad to hear your finally getting it sorted pall. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toi gulp Posted January 15, 2010 Author Report Share Posted January 15, 2010 I was thinking of this today, we was doin a gear box on a bolf, glad to hear your finally getting it sorted pall.Getting there, we will see when i go to pick the car up on tuesday! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toi gulp Posted January 21, 2010 Author Report Share Posted January 21, 2010 all sorted now, all the right ratios back in the box......now to sort out the dodgy gear linkage............damn car costing me a fortune! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lupoluke Posted January 21, 2010 Report Share Posted January 21, 2010 If you have any trouble with the box again give us a shout pall, i know some one whos **** hot at sorting them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toi gulp Posted January 21, 2010 Author Report Share Posted January 21, 2010 If you have any trouble with the box again give us a shout pall, i know some one whos **** hot at sorting them.i think i'll take you up on that............lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lupoluke Posted January 21, 2010 Report Share Posted January 21, 2010 No probs you know where to find me . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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