Real World MPG

[cst]

Hello, first post here.

I'm thinking about changing my 1.8 astra which currently does circa 35 mpg to a lupo to help save some cash and to also scratch that vw itch but I can't decide which model to go for.

Options are:

1. 1.0 - seems to be more out there to choose from

2. 1.4 tdi - most expensive option and pretty scarce.

3. 1.7 sdi - possibly the best option but again scarce, seem cheaper than the tdi.

My route to work is a 50 mile round trip, with all other trips I do about 300 a week. I have 3 route options to work all roughly take the same amount of time and are the same distance +/- 4 miles but vary in style.

1. A road all the way, maintain a constant speed - takes the longest

2. 1/2 motorway followed by 1/2 a road - quickest route

3. Country lanes - can be stop start and a bit of rough route.

So what is the best lupo for my needs and what I realistically expect to get mpg wise? Ideally I would like a £30 year road tax model, all helps with the cost savings but wouldn't be a deal breaker for the right car.

I'm sure there will be more questions soon.

Thanks in advance

[Silver!]

1.4TDi but make sure you get a model after the £30 tax break.

Good around town, and torquey for overtaking. Get a remap to 100bhp-ish and additional torque.

Drive it like a granny and get great MPG; hoof it and you'll get fun!

Nothing wrong with the other 2 models, but I think you'll get tired of the 1.0 for the commute and the SDI whilst a solid reliable runner may become a tad boring.

[Dblock]

If your saving cash maybe check out an arosa as the 1.4tdi arosa can *sometimes* be had cheaper. Price on the 1.4 tdi's is all over the place.

Don't get the 1litre. Its a bit of a screamer for long miles IMO. The 1.4tdi is nice on the motorway, more comfortable than anywhere else IMO.

The 1.4 tdi isn't that fast and it isn't fun. Its very dull and souless but the rest of the car kinda makes up for it.

[coopersim]

Check out my mpg in my sig. 1.0 isn't that bad, and I've come from a 6 cylinder diesel! My best mpg is on the m25 through the 50mph roadworks, which gives you the idea that constant relative low speeds returns the best mpg.

Like you say, there's loads of 1.0 litres to choose from, road tax is £120 a year, and insurance is dirt cheap too (~£160 for me)

I did look for diesels to start with but they mostly have high miles on and I also weighed up the higher price of diesel fuel as well.

Good luck!

Edited May 31, 2013 by coopersim

[Silver!]

The 1.4 tdi isn't that fast and it isn't fun. Its very dull and souless but the rest of the car kinda makes up for it.

Did you mean the 1.7SDi?

1.0 is fine on runs, and I used mine regularly to travel to Glasgow (60 miles each way) and Edinburgh (50 miles each way) and further afield, but not sure I would want to do it on a daily basis.

Young lady I sold it to travels to Edinburgh for work daily and still loves it, but is thinking of something with a bit more cruising ability.

Good nod on the SEAT. All models are usually a bit cheaper.

[Paul]

As the owner of an SDi for 8.5 years / 137,000 miles, I know that my view will be bias, but I'd say that as long as you appreciate the SDi for what it is, you know it's limitations, and you drive it within its capabilities, it's a good all-rounder. It only has 60bhp, but you've got the low-down torque of a diesel and it'll sit at 58mph/2000rpm all day long and return high mpg figures. The best I've ever seen is 82mpg, but for everyday motorway and A-road driving, I'm averaging 67mpg. A steady run on the motorway should see 70-72mpg, and even when doing an 'Italian tune-up' and taking it to the red line, I can't get below 60mpg.

Both SDi and TDi models registered after 1 March 2001 (Y-reg) qualify for the £30 road tax, which the 1.0 doesn't. And motorway speeds will mean the 50bhp petrol engine is spinning faster and isn't so economical on fuel. And it doesn't have the torque of a diesel, either.

I've not driven a Lupo TDi but I have driven other TDi cars (VAG and others) and I've always found that the temptation of the turbo sees me driving faster than I do in the SDi, so I rarely see high mpg figures...

Many say that the SDi is slow and boring, but as I said, if you drive to its capabilities and know where the power band is, a well-serviced one can surprise a lot of sceptics.

[James827]

above. ive gone from an SDI to (albeit) an older Turbo diesel and with aspect of boost i do find myself driving much faster.

my lupo would regularly return 65mpg on a trip i do everyday probably very similar to yours. and would never really dip even if i drove it like i stole it. again ive never driven a lupo TDI but i have a college friend with a polo 1.4TDI, he has a heavy foot and gets about 45 mpg on the same route.

not sure about the TDI but the SDI does sit lovely at 56mph, which if you can take, cruising at that speed wil save you so so so much fuel

my Turbo D MK2 sits at much higher revs and with a Little throttle boosts its way up past 75 without you realizing. the lupo would just sit and do 56 all day long, i feel in the golf im accelerating and slowing down all the time, which i didnt in the lupo

[Dblock]

Did you mean the 1.7SDi?

1.0 is fine on runs, and I used mine regularly to travel to Glasgow (60 miles each way) and Edinburgh (50 miles each way) and further afield, but not sure I would want to do it on a daily basis.

Young lady I sold it to travels to Edinburgh for work daily and still loves it, but is thinking of something with a bit more cruising ability.

Good nod on the SEAT. All models are usually a bit cheaper.

No meant the tdi. It's ok round town and it's great on the motorway. But for example on a country road a 1l petrol is a lot more fun. The tdi only has go from 1800-2500rpm and it's pretty boring when your driving to keep it in that power band. Go above that the engine makes more noise but you don't go anywhere as you have run out of torque. I even found my last sport was great round town and on country roads but it's wasn't good on the motorway. Sitting at 3.5-4k to do 70mph got old quick.

IMO go for a tdi or sdi and enjoy it for its frugality.

[Lupo-dreams]

I agree, if you're really serious about getting high mpg above all else, then the SDI is probably the winner. If you use the 'A road/constant speed all the way' route then it will reward you with very high mpg (I get at least 67mpg and I don't dawdle or even try many fuel-saving tricks. If there's not many hills or stops and slow-downs then 72mpg is easy). Like what's been said, you don't even have to take it over 2000 rpm for the whole journey on A roads if you're chilled out and keep economy in mind. Motorways at 70mph will not be much more rpm so you're not screaming along. I agree, driving a turbo diesel (I've had a few) is just too tempting to give it the beans all the time and ruin any chance of serious mpg. But having said that, the 1.4TDI will be a close second for your particular needs, so it all depends what you find for sale at the right price and what you fancy. Also, if there's snow you have to drive in, the SDI kicks arse, especially if you wack snow tyres on at least the front wheels. I was so impressed with mine getting up 14% hills with no run-up when it was white over...there was only me and a couple of 4x4s that could do it.

Just to add, you can find a SEAT Arosa or Lupo with the 1.4TDI in the £30 tax bracket, but won't find an Arosa 1.7 SDI in the £30 tax bracket (they're too old to qualify), the Lupo SDI carried on alongside the TDIs though.

[Silver!]

I just asked as I've been on some road trips with a couple of TDIs {Jon_273 and Helen} hoofing it around North Yorkshire and the Lakes and they coped pretty admirably.

[cst]

Thanks for your advice guys, are there any mechanical problems with with either the 1.7sdi or 1.4tdi, that would swing it either way. Obviously the 1.7 is n/a so no turbo to go wrong but I have noticed gearbox issues on here for the 1.7? I think its a case of biding my time and getting the right car for the right money not first one I see.

I'm not fussed on 0-60 and hooning round as with the money I save I will look to invest into a second car, plus my normal route entails sitting behind a school bus with no overtaking options.

I do like the arosa but I prefer the lupo, especially one on the starlites.

[patroddy]

A 1.0 is fine on a daily commutte I do average 70 miles a day in my 1.0 on the motor way I'm looking anywhere from 30 - 48mpg all depends on whether I'm late or early :') only downside is it sits 4k RPM doing 65/70 so it can get noisy but my sub soon dnds that out I do around 350-400 miles a week never fill up more than £45/50 if the fuels badly price

[James827]

people get issues with 1.7SDI gearboxes and pedal boxes, but that doesnt rule out the TDI, ive seen some on here with bad gear boxes and broken pedal boxes.

the 1.7 box is pretty specific, but if you have some spare cash and one pops up why not?

my 1.7SDI hadent ever had a pedal box or gear box through my ownership (passed it on at 87k)

LOTS of 1.9 tdi/sdi/D parts fit on the sdi

plus i like the noise.

[Paul]

Thanks for your advice guys, are there any mechanical problems with with either the 1.7sdi or 1.4tdi, that would swing it either way. Obviously the 1.7 is n/a so no turbo to go wrong but I have noticed gearbox issues on here for the 1.7? I think its a case of biding my time and getting the right car for the right money not first one I see.

I'm not fussed on 0-60 and hooning round as with the money I save I will look to invest into a second car, plus my normal route entails sitting behind a school bus with no overtaking options.

I do like the arosa but I prefer the lupo, especially one on the starlites.

Again, I can't speak for the TDi, and I can only speak from personal experience of my SDi.

She's a December 2001 '51'-reg that was on 25k when I bought her in January 2005 and is now on 162k. In that time and mileage (excluding the wear and tear things such as tyres, brakes and bulbs), the central locking has ceased to work from outside the car, I've had the pedal box replaced (in February 2008 at around 55k) and the gearbox was rebuilt at around 130k due to a thrust race bearing failure as I recall. As the gearbox was out, I had the clutch changed at the same time. The front wheel bearings were replaced about 20k miles ago and I've had one exhaust fitted (at around 106k) and I'm still on the original factory-fitted battery. She flew through the MoT last week with just a cautionary for a slightly split CV boot. I know that reading through that would suggest I've had a few problems, but apart from the typically Lupo pedal box, gearbox and central locking issues, they're all age and mileage related things.

The best thing you could do is test drive a few SDi and a few TDi Lupos to see which suits you, because not all SDis and not all TDis are going to feel exactly the same. I see on your profile that you're in Kent, but if you're around Brum you're welcome to come out in mine and see what you think of her, but she'll never be for sale

[Dblock]

I just asked as I've been on some road trips with a couple of TDIs {Jon_273 and Helen} hoofing it around North Yorkshire and the Lakes and they coped pretty admirably.

I'm not saying they are super slow but it's not really any fun taken the tdi on a country road. Its ok when your trying to keep the revs and gear in the torque band but still not fun.

[Skezza]

I haven't driven a TDI but I can only say good things about the SDI and 1.0 MPI. Since owning an SDI my fuel consumption has been really excellent. In my first week of ownership, despite the fact it was desperately in need of a service I averaged 64Mpg. My highest is about 68Mpg so I'm yet to hit the 70Mpg mark but I drive quite aggressively even when I'm trying to be conservative lol. My lowest Mpg is 58 which was on a trip to Blackpool in which I barely dropped below 90mph (naughty I know). I really hammered it straight up the motorway. It was very comfortable and had no problems at that speed.

My previous Lupo otherwise known as The Green Machine was a pov spec 1.0 and it happily handled my 76 mile round trip to work every day. On the motorway, it screamed, and it was loud but it was surprisingly comfortable at between 60 70. Anything above that and you were totally thrashing the balls off it.

[Lupogti4376]

My thoughts on this is to go for a polo gt am running this as my commuting car had it from 35k now on 171k original cluch turbo exsaust drive At 60ish to work 70-85 home cost £53 to fill get about 450 miles and fun when you want

[Nadeemaashraf]

I've got a remapped 1.4tdi arosa. Its amazing! Put in £10 and get 75-100 miles out of it. Goes like stink when I want to thrash it.

And it's for sale...

[Sir Loopalot]

After having driven all three, the 1.0 can be fun and nippy if your stomp happy, ok with poor fuel economy and it screaming everywhere you go... it saves a bit more coin if you drive drive it chilled out @ or 5mph below the speed limits, with its ideal situation being short urban trips where your starting and stopping a lot, providing your pulling away gradually from lights etc.

what's been said about it on motorways is quite true... you feel like your on a kamakazi mission over pearl harbour with how much engine scream you get, it just doesn't feel happy

the 1.7 SDI can feel a touch heavy and lumpy at times... it's more of a work horse and will see you up hills with little effort.
as I think was previously mentioned on here if you have a relaxed driving style this is an ideal car for casually getting from a-b over long distances.
Not so efficient on those door to door trips.


The 1.4 TDI is a good all rounder... I actually prefered this over the GTI, but everyones different

as standard, the ones I have driven have all given me about 12-15pence per mile mixed driving (running about and 50-80mile trips).

Again this also has no trouble getting up hills, and is fairly swift in getting upto speed without having to be heavy footed

The TDI usually features a few more mod cons than the 1.0MPI and the 1.7SDI, like electric windows, ac, electric mirrors, fog lights, etc etc and has a slightly nicer interior.

Motorway journeys like the 1.7 SDI aren't a problem, you can cruise comfortably, and over take without breaking a sweat.
It is true that the temptation is there to floor it all the way with the TDI haha


for me I liked the gti interior, so that is something I've been gradually changing, and I like to have a bit of fun while I'm driving, so it has been remapped after the EGR was swapped out for a straight pipe and the filter replaced with a K&N for a bit more power and throttle responce. Then I dropped it on some coilovers + a new bushing set to improve the handling/cornering.
So now it feels more like a drivers car and I still only shell out 15-18pence per liter, with 35-40 quid filling the tank.

TBH I found my milage actually improved just by removing the EGR and fitting the K&N... which is just a cylinder filter replacement, not a fancy after market cone job, so will fit in the car with no modifications needed
Also gave a moderate increase in acceleration.

You can also have the catalytic converter removed on these for a touch more power and still pass your mot with no problems providing the engine is in good working order, which is usually the case with these cars as the engines are built to last

infact quite a few of VW diesel engines are designed primarily for trucks, tractors, boats etc then repurposed for the cars we drive.


well thats my 2p on the matter, hope this was useful

[Nadeemaashraf]

I've got a 1.4 tdi, love everything about it other than its looks. Bought a Gti! Love it's looks, terrible economy, prefer the drive of my tdi.

What to do realistically?

[Dblock]

Buy a golf?

You perfer the way the tdi drives over a gti? You not like driving?

[Sir Loopalot]

I've got a 1.4 tdi, love everything about it other than its looks. Bought a Gti! Love it's looks, terrible economy, prefer the drive of my tdi.

What to do realistically?

I must say that is an odd one haha, but I can understand where your coming from...

I really like the looks of the GTI especially interior, and it's a great car to drive, yet at the same time, while it will blast about and hugs the road, I tend to miss the torq of a diesel engine and find the accelerator slightly spongey

"this is incomparison to diesels in general not specifically the TDI"

you can either stick with the TDI and maybe swapout the interior and/or front end with GTI parts, with the scope for tuning the TDI engine and suspension should you want more performance

or go for the GTI and get the looks you want... Maybe having it professionally remapped or even eco mapped is it's economy your concerned about... an if you have the money, you could comit a comunity traversty and have the TDI lump put into the GTI haha, although if I was doing that I would go for a 1.9TDI engine rather than the 1.4TDI

[Sir Loopalot]

one thing I do miss with the TDI though is a 6th gear!