Beep Beep Posted January 4, 2009 Report Share Posted January 4, 2009 My car has been misfiring intermittently for sometime. The garage have been unable to mend the fault and so I'm going to have to get it sorted out myself.I have been looking at the website and seen that misfiring appears to be a common problem with Lupos and spark plugs seem to be the first thing I should check. Unfortunately it looks like my car has an unusual engine layout which makes it difficult to gain access to the spark plugs.To gain access we need to extract the ignition coils, this requires a special tool: Ignition coil puller for VW Lupo BBY engine, part number T10094 or T10094A as shown at the following URL:https://erwin.volkswagen.de/workshop/englis...ial/t10094a.htmDoes anyone know where we can get one from in the Bristol area?I'd be very grateful for your help! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2001gti Posted January 4, 2009 Report Share Posted January 4, 2009 (edited) i had a slight miss fire on mine cummin back from E38. apparently it was caused by revving the car to much and abit of oil had got into the cylinder a quick wipe out and some new spark plugs sorted it right out.EDIT: im intrigued as to wot u mean by an unsual engine lay out. Edited January 4, 2009 by 2001gti Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mat.m. Posted January 4, 2009 Report Share Posted January 4, 2009 Remove engine cover,Remove oil filler neck (Tape over hole)Number up leads note positionUnclip the leads from the lead traySlide tray out the way....well as much as possibleUsing your strongest fingers prise each lead offWhat engine do you have? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beep Beep Posted January 5, 2009 Author Report Share Posted January 5, 2009 Hi,Thanks for the info, I will pass the technical info onto my husband and my dad who are hopefully going to help me mend the car.It’s a 2003 1.4 E, apparently the engine is BBY? I’ve taken a photo of the engine but I'm not sure how to attach it to this message.The garage say they have:- done a full service- cleaned the throttle body- replaced the cylinder head- changed the ignition coils- changed the water temperature and MAP sensorsBut unfortunately it still intermittently misfires and the Exhaust or EPC warning lights sometimes come on too.I am trying to get hold of a VW Polo Haynes manual in case it has the same engine as mine. I’m desperate to get my car fixed as it’s been like this for at least 7 months. Previously it was just stalling in slow moving traffic.After looking at the references to other Lupos misfiring we are going to try looking at the spark plugs first but my husband says we will need this special tool to get to them Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tigz™ Posted January 5, 2009 Report Share Posted January 5, 2009 The plugs are easy to get to with a normal spark plug socket Have you changed the fuel filter?An emissions test at your local MOT centre may be an idea too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gareth Posted January 5, 2009 Report Share Posted January 5, 2009 had a similar problemreplaced spark plugs and ht leads cost around £60 and its to do take 10 minutes.if not may be a new coil pack (i have a brand new one spare) but do the other bits firsti think the cold effects the plastic on the leads and the connections.gary Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lupoluke Posted January 5, 2009 Report Share Posted January 5, 2009 I would say coil pack 10 Mins to change. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andyp Posted January 5, 2009 Report Share Posted January 5, 2009 sounds like coil pack or probably a dodgy lead.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beep Beep Posted January 11, 2009 Author Report Share Posted January 11, 2009 Hi folks,Thanks for the advice you've been giving. My husband replaced the spark plugs on friday so hopefully that will sort it!!!!It did have VW spark plugs which he has replaced with Bosch ones. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike_M Posted January 11, 2009 Report Share Posted January 11, 2009 Bosch have a bad repor with VAG cars. Had a set and they failed after 4 months. Always use the NGK VW ones as they are cheap and work really well with the engine Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beep Beep Posted January 13, 2009 Author Report Share Posted January 13, 2009 Hi,Thanks for the advice The car was ok at the weekend but it's misfired again today. it misfires just on occassions until it gets worse and worse and the warning lights come on.Aparently my car doesn't have HT leads?But my husband has ordered some new ignition coils, I hope these will sort it out.Intermittant faults are such a pain. You don't know it's fixed until you forget there was anything wrong with it and you have to wait until it starts going wrong again.I try to restrict using it but it's been misfiring on and off and going back and forth to the garage since June last year! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike_M Posted January 14, 2009 Report Share Posted January 14, 2009 (edited) It will have HT Leads on a 1.4 (unless its a TDI) for sure as even the GTI has them.If your doing the coil pack you are better off replacing the leads also as they fail arround the same time as them get corroded and break when attempting to remove.This is all the advise I can give...........replace the three area with NGK spark plugs new coil pack and HT leads and she will run like a dream. Edited January 14, 2009 by Mike_M Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beep Beep Posted January 14, 2009 Author Report Share Posted January 14, 2009 Hi Mike,I hope you are right, it would be so good to have the car running nicely again!!!Where abouts would we find the HT leads on my car??? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lupoluke Posted January 14, 2009 Report Share Posted January 14, 2009 There thick wires which come directly off the spark plugs and go in to your coil pack, what reg is your car cause it sounds like it may have independent coil packs for each plug. If it has get it plugged in to vag com and find out which cylinder(s) are misfiring (or pull coil pack off and see how the engine reacts). then replace the coil pack for that cylinder and it should be as sweet as. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beep Beep Posted January 14, 2009 Author Report Share Posted January 14, 2009 Hi,Yes you are right, my husband has said that it independent coil packs for each plug. I like your suggestion lupoluke but the car is only misfiring every now and then, not all the time so I don't know how we could test it.My husband is changing the ignition coils on it this evening so I'll have to see how it runs afterwards.I think my father-in-law has suggested it could be a blocked fuel filter or something like that. but my husbands not sure how he would fix that.By the way it's an 03 registration 1.4 E with a BBY engine Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beep Beep Posted January 14, 2009 Author Report Share Posted January 14, 2009 My husband has changed the ignition coils and tested the car. Apparently it's made no difference He's now wondering if it could be a malfunctioning injector ??? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jon_273 Posted January 15, 2009 Report Share Posted January 15, 2009 OK,here is a pic of a BBY engine:Everyone take note, there are no HT leads, none whatsoever!!! The individual coil packs are under the "1.4 16v" badge.The fuel filter should be replaced at least every 4 years or 40K, they only cost around £8 from dealers so worth a try. Part number 6X0 201 511 B should be the right one but best to check before ordering.Apart from that, if you've fitted new spark plugs and coil packs, try some injector cleaner - this stuff is good, I put some in my mums BBY Lupo when I did a service and never had any probs.Also using good quality fuel helps, i.e. Shell or BP. Do you use supermarket fuel? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beep Beep Posted January 16, 2009 Author Report Share Posted January 16, 2009 Hi Jon,Thanks. Yes that’s what my car looks like under the bonnet! I’ll pass your advice onto my husband. The more often I drive my car the worse it gets until it’s un-drivable and the warning lights come on. If I drive it less often it recovers for a short while.Initially it would just stall a lot, then I first noticed lost of power one day when the fuel refill light came on, on a windy day, driving up a slight incline. But over time it just gradually got worse and worse and happened more and more frequently. Thanks for the advice on fuel. But when we tried putting in quality petrol there was little or no improvement. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beep Beep Posted January 16, 2009 Author Report Share Posted January 16, 2009 Hi Folks,I have passed Jon’s advice onto my husband and he has asked me to ask you experts the following. He says:“I have a theory that it might be the exhaust gas recirculation valve sometimes either opening or closing when it shouldn’t hence causing the misfiring only when driving steadily, not when idling or accelerating. Can you put this question on Club Lupo too? Please ask if it’s sensible to try driving with the exhaust gas recirculation valve disconnected as a test.”Many thanksBB Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lupoluke Posted January 16, 2009 Report Share Posted January 16, 2009 When your lights up get it on the diagnostics should come up with the part(s) thats in error. Tbh i cant see it being the egr valve but i may be wrong, it may well be a cam/crank sensor, but as you say it only happens some times, you need to get the code read really. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jon_273 Posted January 19, 2009 Report Share Posted January 19, 2009 It is normally only diesels which suffer EGR problems because of the soot that builds up, though it's a possibility.Have you replaced the fuel filter like Tigz and I suggested? How many miles has the engine done?Using a fuel system cleaner and spraying carb cleaner down the throttle body whilst revving the engine would be the first things I would try.Also get it put onto VAG-COM and get the fault codes read and reset. The garage I use has a device for identifying intermittent faults like yours. It plugs into the disgnostic port on your car and records data whilst you drive; when the fault occurs the device will show what else happened at the same time (for instance the EGR opened).The garage say they have:- done a full service- cleaned the throttle body- replaced the cylinder head- changed the ignition coils- changed the water temperature and MAP sensorsReplaced the cylinder head? That has got to be a mistake If the garage have been trying since June then I would try somewhere else. Where abouts in the country are you? Perhaps someone can recommend a god garage to take it to. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beep Beep Posted January 19, 2009 Author Report Share Posted January 19, 2009 Hi Jon,Mileage is approx 26,000.Don’t know if fuel filter has been replaced.The garage have at least agreed that the car has not been fixed and refunded the money. My husband is going to try fixing it but if anyone knows a garage in North Bristol or Chippenham that are good with Lupo’s I’d be grateful for their details The details below are the Fault Codes that came up. First is one from 8/8/08 and then 8/9/08:Fault code report________________________________________Date 08 August 2008 Time 17:39:55 ________________________________________Connection detailsOBD standard reported EOBD (Europe)Battery voltage 14.1VDiagnostics protocol AUTO,ISO9141-2VIN (Vehicle ID Number) Not reported by car________________________________________Fault codesFault code Code status Code type DefinitionP0106 Stored Generic Manifold Absolute Pressure/Barometric Pressure Circuit Range/Performance Problem________________________________________Freeze Frame dataFault code Sensor ValueP0106 Sensor values: Calculated Load 0.39 % Coolant Temperature 85. C Short Term Fuel Trim Bank 1 -4.69 % Long Term Fuel Trim Bank 1 5.47 % Intake Manifold Pressure 48 kPa Engine Speed 1355 rpm Vehicle Speed 46 km/h Fuel System 1 Status Closed Loop________________________________________Onboard test resultsOn-board test Current statusMisfire monitor CompletedFuel System monitor CompletedComponents monitor CompletedCatalyst monitor CompletedHeated Catalyst monitor Not supported by carEvaporative System monitor CompletedSecondary Air System monitor Not supported by carA/C Refrigerant monitor Not supported by carOxygen Sensor monitor CompletedOxygen Sensor Heater monitor CompletedEGR System monitor Completed________________________________________Fault code report________________________________________Date 08 September 2008 Time 19:27:25 ________________________________________Connection detailsOBD standard reported EOBD (Europe)Battery voltage 11.9VDiagnostics protocol AUTO,ISO9141-2VIN (Vehicle ID Number) Not reported by car________________________________________Fault codesFault code Code status Code type DefinitionP0106 Stored Generic Manifold Absolute Pressure/Barometric Pressure Circuit Range/Performance Problem________________________________________Freeze Frame dataFault code Sensor ValueP0106 Sensor values: Calculated Load 5.1 % Coolant Temperature 84. C Short Term Fuel Trim Bank 1 31.25 % Long Term Fuel Trim Bank 1 18.75 % Intake Manifold Pressure 62 kPa Engine Speed 1235 rpm Vehicle Speed 43 km/h Fuel System 1 Status Closed Loop________________________________________Onboard test resultsOn-board test Current statusMisfire monitor CompletedFuel System monitor CompletedComponents monitor CompletedCatalyst monitor CompletedHeated Catalyst monitor Not supported by carEvaporative System monitor CompletedSecondary Air System monitor Not supported by carA/C Refrigerant monitor Not supported by carOxygen Sensor monitor CompletedOxygen Sensor Heater monitor CompletedEGR System monitor Completed________________________________________ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beep Beep Posted January 19, 2009 Author Report Share Posted January 19, 2009 Hi,We've now bought a fuel filter and we'll be fitting it at the weekend, so hope that'll fix it!!!!!BB Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beep Beep Posted January 20, 2009 Author Report Share Posted January 20, 2009 Hi,We've found the informaiton from BBA below on Throttle Bodies and it seems to be what happens with my Lupo. We wonder:Could it be a fault in the throttle body causing it to close the throttle valve when it shouldn't (intermittantly)? MAP Sensor has been replacedVDO Throttle Bodies fitted to VW/Audi/MercedesVDO Throttle Bodies fitted to VW/Audi/Mercedes are now failing. Symptoms:- Lack of power/jerkiness on small throttle opening- Incorrect Idle speed/stalling Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jon_273 Posted January 20, 2009 Report Share Posted January 20, 2009 Some info here: http://wiki.ross-tech.com/index.php/16490/P0106/000262Interesting note at the bottom about the timing belt tensioners; the cambelt and tensioners are due for replacement at 4 years old or 40k, whichever comes first so yours should have been changed by now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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