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The definitive Gearbox thread


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Thought I'd add some pics of my gold panning results... To update you- I bought a SDI with a broken pedal box. Shifts were bad, and I think the previous owner had trouble getting 1st and 2nd gear. So they forced the box into gear against the syncromesh rings, causing extra wear. The magnet in the box catches all the steel particles, but the phosphor bronze (brass) bits simply float around in the oil buggering everything up. These particles IMO, are the no1 reason that the gearboxes fail, once they've been forced because of the pedal box failures. You need to completely and correctly de-clutch before selecting a gear........ you can't when the pedal box is broken. Those tiny bits of brass jam between the bearings and cause pitting. Then the bearings fail.... and ultimately the gearbox.

To get the brass bits out, the >only< easy way is to flush the box. To do that, drain any existing oil completely and discard it. Then refill with some cheapo engine oil. Losely insert the drain plug. Jack the car up so both front whels are off the ground (axle stands). Start engine, wheels straight ahead, engage top gear and rev to get about 70MPH on the speedo. A helper is useful. Keep the engine revving for a couple of minutes to well and truly mix the oil in the box and stir up those particles. Keep well clear of those wheels spinning around! While the engine is still stirring the oil, get under the running engine and dump all the oil. As soon as it stops flowing turn off the engine. Keep collecting any oil and drain well. Refill with proper gear oil. Sorted :) Allow the oil to settle in a container/tray like I did and see what you catch....... pics.

My box still runs well with no noise, so hopefully all the flushing has stopped any serious problem for the next few years. These are close ups of the black plastic oil tray I used to collect the clean engine oil after I allowed the particles to settle over a week. Hopefully this will help someone else...

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Edited by mk2
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mk2, cracking post. I think this shows why I need to flush it. Do you believe the engine oil thing is necessary. Never been keen to run up to 70mph on stands, so could always take it for a drive.

What did you use, 5w40 fully synthetic?

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The reason that you want to drain it while it's spinning is because all the particles will still be floating around. As soon as you stop, the larger ones sink to the bottom of the box and don't come out... any cheap engine oil will be ok. Don't leave it in there as it has no gear friction reducing additives in. You need proper gear oil. I used heavy duty tractor diff oil, which is very smooth, but does give slow shifts on really cold mornings.... makes for a super quiet box though!

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Hi, new poster here and would be grateful for a bit of help...Does anyone know if the mk1 and mk2 Arosa (and lupo) use the same gearbox? I imagine they do, but my 1998 mk1 1.0 is leaking oil and I've had the seal replaced but it's still leaking. I'm not mechanically minded but the garage said it's something to do with the gear selector shaft. Anyway, bottom line is I need to find a replacement gearbox and I've found a possible one, but it's from a 2004 1.0 Arosa and I need to know that it will definitely fit my car.

Thanks

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Yeah changed the selector seal, seemed to be ok for a couple of weeks afterwards but now it's leaking worse than ever

Get under the car and find where the oil is coming from...

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  • 2 weeks later...

Got a second opinion on it from a mechanic who put it up on a ramp for me, it's definitely leaking gearbox oil from the selector shaft. He said that when the garage changed the selector seal they might have knocked the shaft and scored it (can't prove it though!!) as there's now an indent on it where the oil is leaking through. It seems to be leaking worst when in 1st and 3rd. So now I need to find a gearbox to match my car's engine code (AER), has anyone had any experience with the elsaWin software you can get on eBay?

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  • 4 weeks later...

My gearbox sometimes pops out of 4th gear, issue stops if I depress the couch and put it bac in there though, reverse gear seems hard to stick in to as well, it seems that the gearbox is fine and it just me at the moment, but I wouldn't like to risk a large sum of cash, would it make sense to swap(upgrade bearings and change oil and seals in the gearbox before it fails?) would that prevent it from happening ? I drive an 2000 1.0 E with 49k on clock

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  • 2 weeks later...
  • 1 month later...

Hi I'm new in owning a lupo and have one with from what i can see is with the usual gearbox fault of noise when driving. I didn't pay a lot for it as only a 2002 1.0 but would like to know what the gearbox codes mean eg mine has FFE but i have seen esy and others so wish to know what the differences are and which ones might fit mine. and is it worth rebuilding it myself. thanks for any help that might available.

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  • 3 months later...

I have just flicked through the whole of this thread and as a potential Lupo buyer I find this all a bit of a concern.

The one thing I have noticed is that the tdi isn't mentioned much when it comes to gearbox problems.

Its the tdi that I am really interested in buying. Do they have a different gearbox than the others. Are they more reliable, or am I getting my hopes up?

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I have just flicked through the whole of this thread and as a potential Lupo buyer I find this all a bit of a concern.

The one thing I have noticed is that the tdi isn't mentioned much when it comes to gearbox problems.

Its the tdi that I am really interested in buying. Do they have a different gearbox than the others. Are they more reliable, or am I getting my hopes up?

I don't have a good source or facts but i never heard about a tdi gearbox breaking! I used to drive a 1.4tdi and i loved it, great cars.

The cam belt operation was not super cheap on that engine, consider that when buying.

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  • 4 weeks later...

I havent read this whole thread, but I have a destroyed 085 box off a 1.0 and the bearing behind the clutch casing on the 4th gear shaft is obliterated and then that's taken out 4th gear and a few other bits too ...

Anyhoo, that bearing looks to have been splash fed as there's a gallery in the casing to get oil behind the nose of the shaft and the bearing itself. i havent looked that close so there might be an oil gallery in the shaft or something else to help out too,

Here's my point: I noticed the oil level plug is about this shafts height, so any drop in oil level will almost certainly starve that bearing. Can anyone confirm this? Where are most failures happening in the box?

Pics of the carnage: You can see the bottom of the oil level plug is actually below the shaft.

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Edited by Sausage
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TDI have the stronger 02T box (well mine does anyway) :yes:

I wonder if the SDI has a stronger box. From my understanding, they simply took the 1.9 SDI box and shrunk it down to fit in a Lupo.

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I wonder if the SDI has a stronger box. From my understanding, they simply took the 1.9 SDI box and shrunk it down to fit in a Lupo.

Do you know if the Lupo/Arisa tdi gearbox is the same as the gearboxes on other VW/Seat/Skoda 1.4 tdi's

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Do you know if the Lupo/Arisa tdi gearbox is the same as the gearboxes on other VW/Seat/Skoda 1.4 tdi's

No clue mate. Not clued up on the TDI too much. I think Sausage has said it might be the 02T box which is stronger.

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Question: do you fill these up until it comes out the filler plug hole, or just put a specific quantity in? i.e is that an oil level hole or just a filler hole?

Plenty of shiny (metal flakes) oil came out of that dead box btw... I didnt measure it but it easily filled the paint roller tray i drained it into. having just now refilled that paint tray with water to a similar level i can say it was at least 2.5l of oil that came out, not a dry box by any stretch of the imagination, but likely under the 3.1L spec.

The oil throw from the diff should oil that bearing and oil level wont affect that too much as the diff sits lower in the oil I'd have thought. So it's probably just not a man enough bearing as it's under double stresses from the diff and the input shaft.

if 3.1L doesnt get to the bottom of the filler hole, I'd be inclined to overfill it a touch.

Edited by Sausage
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polo-mk3-2293.png

On the 085 box it's on the top flange by the inspection plug hole, you'll probably need to clean it up to read the numbers punched out in dots... If it' hard to read shine a torch at a very shallow angle over the dots.

http://workshop-manuals.com/volkswagen/polo-mk3/power_transmission/5-speed_manual_gearbox_085/technical_data/gearbox_identification/

I have a knackered lupo box (pics above) and also a polo box to replace it with. There is a fundamental difference between the boxes i have and that is the gear selector mechanism is different and the polo box is missing the two lugs for mounting the cable selector mech on the lupo.

Not sure if this is for all polo boxes but certainly for mine. I'm not too bothered as mine was £30 and i'm planing on swapping the clutch casing over from the lupo box to hopefully make a good usable lupo box for not much money.

You may want to double check what box you have in mind to replace into a lupo for this reason.

Edited by Sausage
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