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Misfiring Lupo


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My car has been misfiring intermittently for sometime. The garage have been unable to mend the fault and so I'm going to have to get it sorted out myself.

I have been looking at the website and seen that misfiring appears to be a common problem with Lupos and spark plugs seem to be the first thing I should check. Unfortunately it looks like my car has an unusual engine layout which makes it difficult to gain access to the spark plugs.

To gain access we need to extract the ignition coils, this requires a special tool:

Ignition coil puller for VW Lupo BBY engine, part number T10094 or T10094A as shown at the following URL:

https://erwin.volkswagen.de/workshop/englis...ial/t10094a.htm

Does anyone know where we can get one from in the Bristol area?

I'd be very grateful for your help!

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i had a slight miss fire on mine cummin back from E38. apparently it was caused by revving the car to much and abit of oil had got into the cylinder a quick wipe out and some new spark plugs sorted it right out.

EDIT: im intrigued as to wot u mean by an unsual engine lay out.

Edited by 2001gti
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Hi,

Thanks for the info, I will pass the technical info onto my husband and my dad who are hopefully going to help me mend the car.

It’s a 2003 1.4 E, apparently the engine is BBY? I’ve taken a photo of the engine but I'm not sure how to attach it to this message.

The garage say they have:

- done a full service

- cleaned the throttle body

- replaced the cylinder head

- changed the ignition coils

- changed the water temperature and MAP sensors

But unfortunately it still intermittently misfires and the Exhaust or EPC warning lights sometimes come on too.

I am trying to get hold of a VW Polo Haynes manual in case it has the same engine as mine. I’m desperate to get my car fixed as it’s been like this for at least 7 months. Previously it was just stalling in slow moving traffic.

After looking at the references to other Lupos misfiring we are going to try looking at the spark plugs first but my husband says we will need this special tool to get to them :unsure:

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had a similar problem

replaced spark plugs and ht leads cost around £60 and its to do take 10 minutes.

if not may be a new coil pack (i have a brand new one spare) but do the other bits first

i think the cold effects the plastic on the leads and the connections.

gary

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Hi,

Thanks for the advice :)

The car was ok at the weekend but it's misfired again today. it misfires just on occassions until it gets worse and worse and the warning lights come on.

Aparently my car doesn't have HT leads?

But my husband has ordered some new ignition coils, I hope these will sort it out.

Intermittant faults are such a pain. You don't know it's fixed until you forget there was anything wrong with it and you have to wait until it starts going wrong again.

I try to restrict using it but it's been misfiring on and off and going back and forth to the garage since June last year! :(

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It will have HT Leads on a 1.4 (unless its a TDI) for sure as even the GTI has them.

If your doing the coil pack you are better off replacing the leads also as they fail arround the same time as them get corroded and break when attempting to remove.

This is all the advise I can give...........replace the three area with NGK spark plugs new coil pack and HT leads and she will run like a dream.

Edited by Mike_M
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There thick wires which come directly off the spark plugs and go in to your coil pack, what reg is your car cause it sounds like it may have independent coil packs for each plug. If it has get it plugged in to vag com and find out which cylinder(s) are misfiring (or pull coil pack off and see how the engine reacts). then replace the coil pack for that cylinder and it should be as sweet as.

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Hi,

Yes you are right, my husband has said that it independent coil packs for each plug. I like your suggestion lupoluke but the car is only misfiring every now and then, not all the time so I don't know how we could test it.

My husband is changing the ignition coils on it this evening so I'll have to see how it runs afterwards.

I think my father-in-law has suggested it could be a blocked fuel filter or something like that. but my husbands not sure how he would fix that.

By the way it's an 03 registration 1.4 E with a BBY engine

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OK,here is a pic of a BBY engine:

IMAG0155.jpg

Everyone take note, there are no HT leads, none whatsoever!!! The individual coil packs are under the "1.4 16v" badge.

The fuel filter should be replaced at least every 4 years or 40K, they only cost around £8 from dealers so worth a try. Part number 6X0 201 511 B should be the right one but best to check before ordering.

Apart from that, if you've fitted new spark plugs and coil packs, try some injector cleaner - this stuff is good, I put some in my mums BBY Lupo when I did a service and never had any probs.

Also using good quality fuel helps, i.e. Shell or BP. Do you use supermarket fuel?

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Hi Jon,

Thanks. Yes that’s what my car looks like under the bonnet! :)

I’ll pass your advice onto my husband.

The more often I drive my car the worse it gets until it’s un-drivable and the warning lights come on. If I drive it less often it recovers for a short while.

Initially it would just stall a lot, then I first noticed lost of power one day when the fuel refill light came on, on a windy day, driving up a slight incline. But over time it just gradually got worse and worse and happened more and more frequently. :(

Thanks for the advice on fuel. But when we tried putting in quality petrol there was little or no improvement. :(

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Hi Folks,

I have passed Jon’s advice onto my husband and he has asked me to ask you experts the following. He says:

“I have a theory that it might be the exhaust gas recirculation valve sometimes either opening or closing when it shouldn’t hence causing the misfiring only when driving steadily, not when idling or accelerating. Can you put this question on Club Lupo too? Please ask if it’s sensible to try driving with the exhaust gas recirculation valve disconnected as a test.”

Many thanks

BB

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When your lights up get it on the diagnostics should come up with the part(s) thats in error. Tbh i cant see it being the egr valve but i may be wrong, it may well be a cam/crank sensor, but as you say it only happens some times, you need to get the code read really.

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It is normally only diesels which suffer EGR problems because of the soot that builds up, though it's a possibility.

Have you replaced the fuel filter like Tigz and I suggested? How many miles has the engine done?

Using a fuel system cleaner and spraying carb cleaner down the throttle body whilst revving the engine would be the first things I would try.

Also get it put onto VAG-COM and get the fault codes read and reset. The garage I use has a device for identifying intermittent faults like yours. It plugs into the disgnostic port on your car and records data whilst you drive; when the fault occurs the device will show what else happened at the same time (for instance the EGR opened).

The garage say they have:

- done a full service

- cleaned the throttle body

- replaced the cylinder head

- changed the ignition coils

- changed the water temperature and MAP sensors

Replaced the cylinder head? That has got to be a mistake :huh:

If the garage have been trying since June then I would try somewhere else. Where abouts in the country are you? Perhaps someone can recommend a god garage to take it to.

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Hi Jon,

Mileage is approx 26,000.

Don’t know if fuel filter has been replaced.

The garage have at least agreed that the car has not been fixed and refunded the money. My husband is going to try fixing it but if anyone knows a garage in North Bristol or Chippenham that are good with Lupo’s I’d be grateful for their details :)

The details below are the Fault Codes that came up. First is one from 8/8/08 and then 8/9/08:

Fault code report

________________________________________

Date 08 August 2008 Time 17:39:55

________________________________________

Connection details

OBD standard reported EOBD (Europe)

Battery voltage 14.1V

Diagnostics protocol AUTO,ISO9141-2

VIN (Vehicle ID Number) Not reported by car

________________________________________

Fault codes

Fault code Code status Code type Definition

P0106 Stored Generic Manifold Absolute Pressure/Barometric Pressure Circuit Range/Performance Problem

________________________________________

Freeze Frame data

Fault code Sensor Value

P0106 Sensor values:

Calculated Load 0.39 %

Coolant Temperature 85. C

Short Term Fuel Trim Bank 1 -4.69 %

Long Term Fuel Trim Bank 1 5.47 %

Intake Manifold Pressure 48 kPa

Engine Speed 1355 rpm

Vehicle Speed 46 km/h

Fuel System 1 Status Closed Loop

________________________________________

Onboard test results

On-board test Current status

Misfire monitor Completed

Fuel System monitor Completed

Components monitor Completed

Catalyst monitor Completed

Heated Catalyst monitor Not supported by car

Evaporative System monitor Completed

Secondary Air System monitor Not supported by car

A/C Refrigerant monitor Not supported by car

Oxygen Sensor monitor Completed

Oxygen Sensor Heater monitor Completed

EGR System monitor Completed

________________________________________

Fault code report

________________________________________

Date 08 September 2008 Time 19:27:25

________________________________________

Connection details

OBD standard reported EOBD (Europe)

Battery voltage 11.9V

Diagnostics protocol AUTO,ISO9141-2

VIN (Vehicle ID Number) Not reported by car

________________________________________

Fault codes

Fault code Code status Code type Definition

P0106 Stored Generic Manifold Absolute Pressure/Barometric Pressure Circuit Range/Performance Problem

________________________________________

Freeze Frame data

Fault code Sensor Value

P0106 Sensor values:

Calculated Load 5.1 %

Coolant Temperature 84. C

Short Term Fuel Trim Bank 1 31.25 %

Long Term Fuel Trim Bank 1 18.75 %

Intake Manifold Pressure 62 kPa

Engine Speed 1235 rpm

Vehicle Speed 43 km/h

Fuel System 1 Status Closed Loop

________________________________________

Onboard test results

On-board test Current status

Misfire monitor Completed

Fuel System monitor Completed

Components monitor Completed

Catalyst monitor Completed

Heated Catalyst monitor Not supported by car

Evaporative System monitor Completed

Secondary Air System monitor Not supported by car

A/C Refrigerant monitor Not supported by car

Oxygen Sensor monitor Completed

Oxygen Sensor Heater monitor Completed

EGR System monitor Completed

________________________________________

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Hi,

We've found the informaiton from BBA below on Throttle Bodies and it seems to be what happens with my Lupo. We wonder:

Could it be a fault in the throttle body causing it to close the throttle valve when it shouldn't (intermittantly)? MAP Sensor has been replaced

VDO Throttle Bodies fitted to VW/Audi/Mercedes

VDO Throttle Bodies fitted to VW/Audi/Mercedes are now failing. Symptoms:

- Lack of power/jerkiness on small throttle opening

- Incorrect Idle speed/stalling

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Some info here: http://wiki.ross-tech.com/index.php/16490/P0106/000262

Interesting note at the bottom about the timing belt tensioners; the cambelt and tensioners are due for replacement at 4 years old or 40k, whichever comes first so yours should have been changed by now.

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